Converting my 93 passat from automatic to manual!

[Mr_Diesel]

Finally! I finally got fed up with the auto trans and did most of the swap today... Woke up early at around 7:00am and didn't stop until about 9:00pm!
http://www.dubnetworks.net/dubhost/d/3498-2/DSC01573.JPG

And installed an o2a:

http://www.dubnetworks.net/dubhost/d/3492-2/DSC01568.JPG

And a PROPER pedal cluster!

http://www.dubnetworks.net/dubhost/d/3495-2/DSC01569.JPG

Man! That was a huge pain in the ass! Getting the old pedal cluster out wasn't too hard, but getting the new one in took several hours. I actually ended up chopping off the floor heater duct (you can see it in the pictures) to get the thing in. What's annoying is that you would move/remove something to get it in a bit further, then find out you have to remove more and more and more stuff. If I had to do it all over again, I would remove the steering column... Anyways, after about 4 (bleeding) injuries to my hand, I got the pedal cluster in with the clutch pedal, brakes and accelerator pedals all working beautifully.

The other REALLY big PITA part was getting the old automatic out. Apparently you are supposed to remove the torque converter WITH the transmission. There are those three studs/bolts holding the torque converter to that little flywheel thing. For the LIFE of me, I couldn't get the automatic to clear the subframe with the torque converter still in there... See, I come from a long lineage of manual transmissions, where you can just remove the trans leaving the clutch where it sits. Not so on slush-o-matics. Bentley says to remove the torque converter with it. So after 4 hours of fighting with it, I consulted the Bentley. Behold, after removing the 3 nuts, the trans fell to the ground and pretty much destroyed my used fluids container. But, at the same time, a sigh of relief to get rid of the transmission that went the way of the dodo bird.

I guess I should have consulted the Bentley from the beginning. Ohhh well, hopefully I'll never have to deal with an automatic EVER again.

Done:

Swap in the clutch components and o2a
Swap in pedal cluster and hydraulic components

Left to do:

Splice into the auto trans harness
Swap in the shifter box
Buy new CV axles and install

But yeah... today's escapade really made me hate working on VR6 cars... everything is too dang tight. I wouldn't have had this problem on a 4 cyl. :( It'll be worth it in the end... I just hope that I don't have to take it apart again to fix something I missed :banghead:

Anyways, I am going to disassemble the automatic trans and find out EXACTLY what caused it to die. I plan on taking a few dozen pictures to document the investigation for the benefit of the VW community. I think I'll also take a cutting torch to the torque converter and see what's inside. :gift:

[zukgod1]

Dont throw that trans out, lets take it apart to see how it works and what stopped working..

[zukgod1]

Anyways, I am going to disassemble the automatic trans and find out EXACTLY what caused it to die. I plan on taking a few dozen pictures to document the investigation for the benefit of the VW community. I think I'll also take a cutting torch to the torque converter and see what's inside. :gift:


Just saw this ;)

No torch on the converter. Cut off wheel..

[Mr_Diesel]

Ohhh I definitely want to take it apart... It would be my last form of revenge... to completely disassemble the unit before I get rid of it. That would be the ultimate smackdown to the trans.

I'll use a cutting torch... just gotta pray the fluid inside doesn't explode. Perhaps I'll do it out in the road! Haha... well... I've got a lot of cutting disks and no cutting torch, so I guess I'll just use a cutting disk.

[zukgod1]

Ya I was thinking more of a safety thing then anything on the converter. I'm with you, a torch would be way faster but I suspect there would be flamage.

[Mr_Diesel]

I started up the passat today! First life since I started tearing it apart! I got the shifter box in yesterday. I cut the bolts that held the exhaust to the downpipe cause they were completely rusted. Anybody know of any bolts that WONT rust down there? Perhaps I'll try a galvanized bolt... or stainless steel.

Anyways... the swap is completely done for the most part. All I have left is to install the CV axles, which are on order and will be here Friday. Then, take it to an exhaust shop to install 2 3/4" pipe. Then tires/alignment and she's ready for the road.:D

[zukgod1]

That is awesone!!

Cant wait for a ride in tne VR6 Passat Wagon..

I really like the wagon..

:D

[Mr_Diesel]

Both the CV axles will be in today... I'm going to get those installed and get the exhaust put back together tomorrow morning.

[kanatarider]

Hi everyone
I just joined a few days ago, to ask Mr_Diesel some questions, and he suggested that perhaps I should reply to this thread, to further build on and add to the knowledge and info already present.

So, here are the going ons as of so far (sorry about the formatting...read my post, the bottom one, first!)



Originally Posted by Mr_Diesel
You read my post then? The mark III (your car) has the same auto tranny harness as my passat. All you have to do is unplug the TCM (under the driver's side rear seat and then twist the appropriate wires together on the trans harness (i forget the colors, check my thread). That enables the starter to function so it knows it's in "park" or "neutral".

Since you have a donor car, that'll make your life 10 times easier. The shifter box is quit self explanatory. Remove the heat shield under the car and you should see the bolts that hold the shifter to the chassis. They should both bolt/unbolt the same. The auto trans shifter is just one cable. The manual trans shifter bolts to the steering rack for added support (just pay attention to disassembly and you'll get it right). You might even consider removing the manual trans from yoru donor car first... that'll make removing the shifter easier.

Anyways, after that everything is just plug and play really. The pedal cluster is a pain in the ass, but it bolts right up. You have to peel the carpet back a little. Get yourself a LONG extension to get the bolts up closer to the top of the firewall... there's about 8 bolts... if i remember correctly.

On the auto trans car there's a metal bracket tht bolts to the crank... on my passat it had 3 bolts that held the torque converter to the engine. You'll want to unbolt those three bolts before removing the trans. The torque converter is supposed to come out with the trans. After that just use an impact wrench and remove the bolts that hold the plate to the crank, bolt the manual trans components in it's place, bolt the manual trans up connect the clutch cable and shifter mechanism and axles then you are set.

Don't worry about wiring, hundreds of people have done this the way I did it successfully.

Let me know how it goes.


-D


Quote:
Originally Posted by kanatarider
Hi there! I stumbled upon your post and you are the man I need to talk to!
I have a 97 Golf 2.0l, automatic. Reverse just died, I've always wanted this thing in stick, and I got a donor car for ridiculosly cheap. Granted, many say that it is cheaper to just sell the auto car and buy a manual version, but the amount I have paid for the auto and then the parts car is dismally low. Under $200 for the pair, and my 97 is mint mint mint.

So, I know your car was a VR6, but you could still probably be of help...

I have mechanical experience, and I am not too scared of the swap. Trans, clutch and all components, shifter and components, axles, ecu, etc etc are all fine. The electrical protion however is a bit of an issue for me. How indepth of a modification was it to get the auto wiring harness to accept the manual ECU? Is it fairly straight forward, (IE just remove the auto trans wiring), or is it pretty in depth? Anything I should be concerned about, in regards to what you experienced? Advice? Thanks alot!!!




So, with that said, I shall be posting pics of my current car within a day or so, and I pick up the donor on the 23rd. So I will take pics, then document the entire process. I expect to start dismantling the donor the week of the 23rd, a few hours each nite, and then spend the July long weekend (Canada day, eh) building up my car.

Now, my final question; what cool thing can I do with my gear selector display on the dash?? Once converted it won't be any good...I was thinking of putting something neat in there, like a gauge or something, instead of leaving as a selector display. Any thoughts?

[zukgod1]

Well reading Mr Diesel's thread will get you a long way all by it's self but if you have specific questions post em up and we will help out when/where we can.

As to the selector display is concerned, I haven't seen one up close so I don't know what your up against but maybe a small piece of smoked plexy over it?

[zukgod1]

Oh ya, Welcome to the board as well...

[kanatarider]

zukgod: I will take a pic tonight of the display, and post it up.

Mr_Diesel:
What wires in regards to the trans harness did you have to twist together? Also, reverse lights: how?

[Mr_Diesel]

As far as the trans wire harness, I jumped pins 1 and 3 then pins 4 and 6 on that 6 pin harness (don't worry about reversing it... it's the same no matter which way you look at the harness ;)) And that did the trick to disable the park/neutral starter safety. I left the TCM connected because I heard somewhere that the speedometer signal goes through the TCM (for some reason?)

The car still isn't fully on the road so I can't really test the speedometer theory.

[kanatarider]

Sorry for lack of pics as of yet, been busy...
Pick up my parts car tonight, and it's a good thing...drive has started to act up, not changing gears when it's supposed to and not going into gear...I will take pics of the parts car tonight if it stops raining, and then I will take pics of the process...I will take pics of my car when I clean it haha.

[Mr_Diesel]

If you drive it nice you can probably make that trans last atleast another year... But it's good you are making the effort to fix it now instead of after it dies.

[kanatarider]

Drive it nice? Pft. No way. Not my cup of tea :)

I woudln't give this a year. Once it gets hot it is real tempermental. Drive takes a few seconds to engage from a stop, first gear revs up to 4700rpm with light throttle and bangs into second...and stays there, regardless of speed.

[Mr_Diesel]

Well.... Save yourself a HUGE headache and be real careful with the wiring when you do this swap. I created a gremlin when I did my swap and I could never figure out the problem. My car had a BAD misfire... like 1 or more cylinders weren't getting spark at all. I came down to the conclusion of bad ECU or bad ground somewhere. Anyways, just be careful with the wires, especially under the dash when you change the pedals out.

[kanatarider]

That's scary...a rare occurance or a constant hassel?
Just got the donor now. A day late, and at ten to midnight...but the price was right. New clutch, new muffler, spare new muffler, valve oil seals (they need to be changed in the motor), two door with alloys. Motor has roughly 230 000kms...40 thou more than mine. I am going to see what the car looks like in daylight to decide if I am going to swap tranny's or just build this one...but I think I am gonna just swap it. Pics when there is light out!

[Mr_Diesel]

My issues were definitely unique to my situation and my car... just be careful and don't get careless and you'll be fine.

[kanatarider]

Here's my donor! More pictures in my album...Sorry it's mega huge. I will fix that one day
http://www.dubnetworks.net/picture.php?albumid=5&pictureid=61

[Mr_Diesel]

Wait... That's a VR6 GTI, right?

[kanatarider]

I wish!! That would indeed make for a kick ass project!

[Mr_Diesel]

So you have a 16V passat with an auto in it then? I though you had a vr6 passat. That makes sense now. BTW, the fear I instilled in you about the wiring is irrelevant on the 16V passat, because they use a fairly fool proof injection system. The VR6 is very complex.

[kanatarider]

Uh oh, I think we are both mixed up all together. Mine is an MK3 Golf, 2.0L...

[kanatarider]

OK, day one of the swap!

No pics, unfortunately I realized I just don't have the ability to work and take pictures...I hate stopping what I am doing... http://www.ottawa-vdubbing.com/forums/phpBB2/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Woke up early, drove out to my car. Put up the donor and decided to start with the pedal cluster, then the tranny, then the shifter. My reasoning being that the shifter has to be removed from underneath the car, and the clutch cable for me was easier to remove from the cluster...

So battled that for an hour and a bit. There is a piece of air ducting that I hacked off as it was in my way, haven't figured out how to NOT do that with my actual car...I believe there are 6 nuts holding the cluster on. I removed the Steering column to make the removal easier.

Column is pretty straight forward. At the floor there is a u-joint that is one bolt to disconnect. Then after you remove the cover for the column there are two tamper proof bolts holding the coulmn in place. Hammer and chisel to loosen...or air chisel, just careful where you end up...The tamper proof bolts look like carriage bolts BTW.

Once all the nuts were off the cluster, disconnect the clutch, gas, and brake. Twist and pry to remove the cluster. left side has to come straight forward, so I pried it, while twisting the right side to clear the frame.

After that it's time to move onto the tranny. Lift the car, take off the wheels, realize that AGAIN I don't have a socket for the axle nuts...go to CTC and buy one, go back home. Remove axle nuts, disconnect the hub assembly from the struts and pop the axles out of em. This is when I discovered that not all axles can be popped out by a prybar...VW's are bolted on with 10mm 12point torx like bits. GET THIS! You will need it for the flywheel from whatI gathered afterwards...

HOWEVER, I looked at everything, and thought, "It will clear." So I left the axles in. Don't Take them off. The tranny clears, the drivers axle clears...the passenger side catches about a 1/2" of engine block. Even after 2 hours of twisting, prying, grunting, swearing, cursing, screaming...Take the *******s off http://www.ottawa-vdubbing.com/forums/phpBB2/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif

So that's where everything is now...Everywhere was closed by the time I learned of the bit I would need, so I just stripped most of the rest of the car to not feel useless...

Moral of the story...TAKE OUT THE AXLES! 10MM 12 POINT!!!!

Hopefully tomorrow the donor car will have an hour of work left, then I can start on the actual swap...

[zukgod1]

Anything to update?

[kanatarider]

Ya...I had a two page update and then my net crashed...so I will quickly update for now...

SWAP DONE!
Car runs great. Only thing is I hate this auto adjust clutch cable...I'm thinking of hunting down an adjustable one. I seem to have some clutch issues (seems too tight). And once it starts working great...it adjusts and I go back to super tight. Starts to engage very close to the floor still....Not at all like the donor...

[hyzyhy]

I totally love this article. I think you could write some other things to make your blog more complete.For example：
cheap ed hardy (http://www.cheap-ed-hardy.com/).vibram fivefingers (http://www.vibramfivefingerssale.us/)
p90x dvd set (http://www.p90xworkoutdvdset.com/).cheapest mbt shoes (http://www.bestmbtshoes.us/).ed hardy dress (http://www.cheap-ed-hardy.com/ed-hardy-dresses-c-60).vibram fivefinger womens (http://www.vibramfivefingerssale.us/vibram-fivefingers-women-c-68).mbt tataga denim women (http://www.bestmbtshoes.us/MBT_Tataga-c-21-b0).I thought that many people can like.